Hillary N’ the Hood

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Hillary was in the hood yesterday. Apparently, she was there thowin’ gang signs, drinkin 40′s, and schmoozin’ wit her peeps at the Zion Missionary Baptist Church of Compton, California. I can officially say that her campaign of deceptive rapprochment has begun.

Surrounded by an exclusively black cast of characters not ashamed to be seen with her, they plied her with tacky trinkets like the t-shirt and cap proffered above. She returned the gesture by saying that she would focus on assisting brotha’s in finding jobs by instituting some eco-liberal “green collar” jobs program and funding a program to transition ex-cons to work. “A lot of our young people, disproportionately young people of color, are in the prison system and they don’t belong there. They are non-violent offenders.” She said to rapturous applause.

Interesting thought since it was her husband’s 1994 crime bill which locked most of em’ up in the first place. Miz Hillary left that part out. The Center on Juvenile and Criminal Justice called Massa Bill the “Incarceration President.”

According to the Center, on the eve of the inauguaral of Dubya, “When William Jefferson Clinton took office in 1993, he was embraced by some as a moderate change from the previous twelve years of tough on crime Republican administrations. Now, eight years later, the latest criminal justice statistics show that it was actually Democratic President Bill Clinton who implemented arguably the most punitive platform on crime in the last two decades. In fact, “tough on crime” policies passed during the Clinton Administration’s tenure resulted in the largest increases in federal and state prison inmates of any president in American history.”

What does that mean for coloredfolk? Well, according to the center, it meant nothing good.“While everyone is affected by the nation’s quadrupling of the prison population, the African American community has borne the brunt of the nation’s incarceration boom. From 1980 to 1992, the African American incarceration rate increased by an average of 138.4 per 100,000 per year. Still, despite a more than doubling of the African American incarceration rate in the 12 years prior to President Clinton’s term in office, the African American incarceration rate continued to increase by an average rate of 100.4 per 100,000 per year. In total, between 1980 and 1999, the incarceration rate for African Americans more than tripled from 1156 per 100,000, to 3,620 per 100,000.”

Faced with a horrendous drop in her poll numbers in the black community, a result of defending her billionaire minstrel’s defamation of Barack Obama, she’s backtracking to stress that she is not anti-black at all. We just imagined it. The Clintons have always been pro-active on black issues. That’s the drivel Bob Johnson was pushing last week. The record says something different and its high time that we recognized it.

 

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45 thoughts on “Hillary N’ the Hood

  1. jay

    Have you heard about the new Magic Johnson Ad in South Carolina? She just has to bring out the basketball player for the black folk. Obama had Jesse Jackson Jr cutting ads for him awhile back,now she has Magic. And on top of that, Magic says that Obama’s a “hyped” rookie, when he had the one the best rookie seasons ever. Shameless.
    See both of these links:
    http://marcambinder.theatlantic.com/archives/2008/01/clinton_brings_the_magic_to_so.php
    http://marcambinder.theatlantic.com/archives/2008/01/but_magic_johnson_was_an_aweso.php

  2. Chesapeake

    You’re right, Brotha. It was during the Clinton administation that prisons, prison building, and prison management became growth industries. Unfortunately, close to half of our people don’t recognize how damaging Bill Clinton was to our people. (Don’t get me started on him snatching the safety net and how that contributed to the growth in construction in inner cities as they gentrified.)

    The real deal is that some black leaders prospered during Clinton’s terms, and they have no compassion for the orphans and widows of our race. They got theirs ….

  3. Greg aka Farrod

    Fellas, please school me on President Clinton. People, including me at one time, sweared by this guy. He gets credit for the economy, the surplus, on and on. A co-worker that says he worked on the welfare reform legislation says that Clinton was ‘forced’to sign his own version because of a Republican Congress. But how is it their fault? Didn’t he campaign on changing welfare?

    And I’m sick of people telling me that so many people were ‘making a living’ off of welfare. Was that really possible?

    What is this guy’s true record?

    Thanks,

  4. You are hilarious. I nearly choked on my drink while reading this.

    Just a reminder. She came out AGAINST retroactivity with regards to drug sentencing. It was in December, at the Black and Brown Forum. Bottom line: she’s vowed to get elected on putting ANOTHER generation of Black men into the Prison Industrial Complex.

    Another reminder, it was BILL Clinton who VETOED lowering mandatory minimums, which has led to TWO generations of Young Black Men being fed to the Prison Industrial Complex.

    Just a couple of bits of REALITY to go side by side with the Clinton DELUSIONS.

    Say what you want about Obama, but he’s on the RIGHT

  5. Obama is on the RIGHT side of this issue….Hillary is NOT. Period.

    So, I don’t want to hear one mumbling word from her apologists about Blacks and the Criminal Justice System when it comes out that she’s vowed to send another generation of Black men to Prison and your Black asses stay MUTE on the subject.

  6. Cliff

    I saw Hillary putting on some gloves at a union metting, okay it is time for us to step in the ring.
    Can’t do it with out the Sistah Support.

    Jab, Jab,

    Right Cross

    “Now, eight years later, the latest criminal justice statistics show that it was actually Democratic President Bill Clinton who implemented arguably the most punitive platform on crime in the last two decades.”

    Hit hard SB.
    Ding, Ding, Ding

    Round 2

    Jab, Jab, UPPERCUT

    “Another reminder, it was BILL Clinton who VETOED lowering mandatory minimums, which has led to TWO generations of Young Black Men being fed to the Prison Industrial Complex.”

    You don’t have to swing that hard, Rikyrah.

    Ding, Ding, Ding
    Round 3

    Jab, Jab, LEFT HOOK

    http://www.blackelectorate.com/articles.asp?ID=320

    “The JPI report reveals that 225,000 more Blacks were incarcerated under Clinton than under President Reagan – the Republican President most disliked in Black America.”

    1-2-3-4-6

    Get up Hillary, GET UP.

    “I LOVE BLACK PEOPLE, DON’T YOU SEE ME IN YOUR CHURCH, WHICH IS IN THE CIIIIIIIIIIITY, CITY OF COMPTON, POP BLOCK?”

    “POP BLOCK?”

    7-8-9-10.

    Knock Out.

    What are you going to do now Mrs. Clinton?

    Hillary: Ahhh just getting ready for a rematch.
    :)

  7. I’m sorry, the more you look at Clinton’s record when he was in the White House, the more you see how readily he and the Borg Queen slung those in their circle under the bus when it became politically expedient to them.

    I’m wondering when the media is going to ask Lani Guinier, Mike Espy, Henry Cisneros and Joycelyn Elders who they’re supporting or endorsing for President in ’08. It will probably be anyone but Hillary – could you blame them?

    And Rikyrah, my colleagues at Black Agenda Report, as well as other indy news outlets, have nothing but contempt for Cynthia Tucker – she led the charge of Cynthia McKinney being loony for trying to call out the racist element on Capitol Hill. So, I don’t take anything she says or writes seriously anymore.

  8. Lucia Akech

    What is depressing is that Billary Clintons are so bent on going back to the White House that they are willing to divide not only the Black Community, but also families (parents against their children, brothers agaisnt brothers, brothers agaisnt sisters, sisters against sisters).

    Can someone enumerate why it is so important for us, as voters, that the Clintons go back White House?
    What are they going to do this time that they could not do during the eights years they were in that office? What difference are they going to make our tearing each other apart worth it?

  9. Rick

    re: family feud
    buckle up, Lucia Akech. If you thought things were testy ahead of Nevada, I got this feelin’ things could get a hill-of-a-lot worse this week ahead of the SC primary on Saturday.

    I met a young sista on Friday; after waiting the customary 1 or 2 days, I gave her a call after I came from church today to see how her day was. She mentioned attending a church — its name I heard on the news circuits as hosting a visit by Hillary Clinton today for MLK weekend.

    * dead silence

  10. Rick

    continued…

    I didn’t want to get into a political confrontation with someone I hardly knew, so I tried to ask a very neutral question: “How was she received?”

    for the next several minutes she LAUNCHED into a very passionate defense about how Hillary’s comments were misinterpreted, and how we as black people were being “too emotional” about the subject. I was slightly taken aback.

    I just listened. I simply told her I had a different view, and then asked her thoughts about “how would she be able to govern as president — which involves the passing of legislation by working with the opposing political party — if she is alienating such a large portion of her own political base of support?”

    *more dead silence

    we quickly switched topics, and the conversation ended quite amicably.

    But it raised a very interesting issue: “Could I date a zealot Hillary supporter?”

    Maybe, that is, if we respected each other’s opinions and right to have our own. But the fact that I was even thinking about this is a sad commentary about how the Clintons have become so involved in our lives…

    * A real-life tale of why politics and dating don’t always mix

  11. Andrea

    This is prophetic, Lucia. History repeats itself. It’s the paradigm shift we have needed. Now seeing if the young will lead and the elders submit is the dilemma. We have mirrored the Israelites that reluctantly fled Egypt to only but doubt Moses and who for so long pissed almost every prophet, apostle, and disciple off with their hard-headed ways. The Jews have since the centuries of not understanding their law and covenants, have now learned and benefited from their history of division and dissidence. We…well…we have not.

    When I was doing UN, I used to tell people that resisted what I was trying to teach them that they reminded me of those hard-headed Israelites that made Moses cuss and break the Tablets. I would tell them they were the equivalent to the Israelites that made Moses want to stay on a mountain-top and not return to work on them. I know…I know…how frustrating it is dealing with hard-headed resisters and it is so understandable why word was given to Joshua that the older generation pissing their God off would not get to the Promise Land — but their children would. For us the parallel has no guarantee because too many young Blacks only know their parents campaigns and excuses. I would piss people off because they knew I was using the Bible, what Black People use as a frame of reference to validate their pathologies (leaving it in the hands of the Lord, etc.), to call them stupid and lazy.

    Life mirrors prophecy in some ways. The oldest book of literature has some very relevant correlations to our lives now.

    Fact: I don’t go to church anymore and hadn’t been since the mid-nineties and that was forced but I do remember all that I was taught in parochial school of prophecy. I never learned anything useful in church but how to assume the ways of thinking of older people who did not follow the covenants and the prophecies forewarned. It moved me as a kid and I see the relationship now as a pathmark to teach us where not to go and where we should be.

    Jesus said:

    “Do not suppose that I have come to bring peace to the earth. I did not come to bring peace, but a sword. For I have come to turn “‘a man against his father, a daughter against her mother, a daughter-in-law against her mother-in-law–a man’s enemies will be the members of his own household.’ Anyone who loves his father or mother more than me is not worthy of me; anyone who loves his son or daughter more than me is not worthy of me”.

    Matthew 10:34-37

    and he said:

    “If anyone comes to me and does not hate his father and mother, his wife and children, his brothers and sisters–yes, even his own life–he cannot be my disciple”.

    Luke 14:26

    Now it does sound like Jesus was pissed off when putting it down like that but I understand he was saying, “I’m not playing with you! Don’t waste my time! And don’t think I don’t know your family don’t want us doing this revolutionary thing!” He was not trying to destroy families…he was trying to break the very similar Black Baby-Boomer hold on us that keeps us hostage to wanting family peace instead of forcing our families to grow and revolutionize their thoughts. Revolution does not always mean to fight. A revolution is a turn…to move…a movement. Jesus was making it clear that there was a conflict of interests and if you were more beholden to the co-dependency of enabling your families’ comfort zones, then no progress would be made.

    If everyone is replicating an old thought process and matched mannerisms of what they think is righteous of a families’ mindset, which is proving to not work or render value.

  12. Rick

    Moses’ generation led the children of Israel out of slavery in Egypt. But, it was Joshua who lead them INTO the land of Canaan, their place of promise.

    The overwhelming majority of those who made the original exodus from Egypt never made it into Caanan. Why?

    Because of their lack of belief. Doubt. Or otherwise disobedience.

    Did you know? The children of Israel were placed in a “holding pattern” until all of the disobedient and disbelieving ones of adult age had died off (Numbers 32:10-13).

    * Incidently, in Selma, Obama said that a new generation of leadership represents the “Joshua Generation”.

  13. blacksurvival

    I am already feed up with this issue over who will be better for the Black community if elected.Being afaid to even examine the issues that affect the Black community,the real issues not the symptoms.How can we effect change if we won’t even see what’s going on in our very midst.The only businesses(so called black controlled) that prosper in my neck of the woods are dope and hope,both negating the minds and metality of black folks.While both dealers and preachers ride around or in the case of some jet around with the precious resources of our community.

    Don’t get me wrong I don’t want to start an argument about belief.I think it was ok to cling to the belief that a white man would come and give us reward in the next life when there was nothing for us in this life.At a time when we really were physical slaves,when there was no other hope.So it’s only my opinion that these so called men of God that the Clintons and other politicians are courting are no more than modern day overseers admonishing us to obey our masters while they line there pockets.

    I can only imagine what was promised and promised to be given at the closed to the press meeting between the black clergy in Chicago and the Clintons.If we don’t admit that there are not only racist individual in the system,but that the system is a racist system of White Supremacy bent on survival through genocide of our black men.Then we all play a part in our own demise,be it mentally,spiritually,or physically.If we continue to assimalate with whites in our inferiorized state of mind,pretending we are functionally there equal,when the evidence shows a vast disparity then Obama’s sucsess will come to nothing.

  14. Rick

    Obama’s Jan 20th Speech at Ebenezer Baptist Church (Call for Unity):

    http://www.c-span.org/
    under Capital News box, under Featured links, see “Recent Programs” : Sen. Barack Obama (D-IL), Campaign Event in Atlanta, GA (1/20/2008) – Full Speech

  15. blacksurvival

    Know Thyself was the advise given to us by our oldest ancesters.Before there was Adam and Eve Jehovah,Yaweh,Moses,Allah,Christianty,Islam,White folks,Arabs,Jews or ebonically speaking JES-US was imposed on us during slavery there was Black Civilization.Wake UP stop assume the cultures of other people and repatriate your mind!

  16. Rick

    RESOLVED: A study of ourselves would lead us to back to Christ and the Christian church:

    * As well known, many scientists believe that humanity first originated in Africa. The first Christian kingdom, Ethiopia, was also found in Africa — tracing its Judeo-Christian roots to King Solomon and Queen Makeda, aka the Queen of Sheba. This Nubian sista was hardly the type to be imposed upon. Quite the opposite — Black women of antiquity were legendary for their beauty, power and ability to manipulate love affairs. She was just one.

    Frederick Douglass might also disagree with you that Christianity was imposed. He risked his life to teach himself to read (the Bible by the way) by candelight — a serious crime during the antebellum South. He choose to.

    Harriet Tubman led freed slaves through the AME Church, well known as being a stop on the underground railroad, and a place where black community meetings and gatherings were held. Certainly this isn’t what white folks had in mind.

    This notion that our ancestors, from antiquity, were passive as Europeans imposed Christianity on them — without our resistance, or adaptation — is not consistent with a reading of our history. Our ancestors adapted. They resisted. They made due. their spirituals, faith, and hope for a brighter day for their descendents is part of the reason we are here today.

    But, to your point, when we study black history (“knowing ourselves”), there is a proud story of the role of the Black Church — not a defeatist story, as alluded to.

  17. Skeptical Brotha:

    About a year ago I told you that Obama was the candidate to vote for. You were fundamentally opposed. Have you come over to the “dark side” yet?

  18. blacksurvival

    So you think Solomon predates Imenhotep,Djoser or the third dynasty Egypt.Fredrick,or Harriet neither had the historical perspective that we have at our diposal today.Sorry if i offended you but if you read your Bible you’ll find that when Abraham the first Hebrew went to Egypt we already had the law a thousand years before Moses.

  19. blacksurvival

    Also by Solomon time 45% of mans civilized exsistence to the current time had past.Please get other books besides the Bible for a more even perspective on history.

  20. Andrea

    Black Survival,

    You need to slow your roll! Fuck what you interpret…you obviously don’t comprehend well because you assumed.

    I don’t hold to this idea that by holding onto defending robotic Afrocentricity, that will reverse the centuries of choices our ancestors made. By knowing the Bible(s), it does make me place less knowing authentic Blackness while placing another cultural frame of reference more preferential in actualizing self-hatred over mine. That connotation pisses me off. You started a fight…let me finish it. You insulted me with your anger because of your fears and self-defensive dogma.

    I know that Jews mastered something we have not been able to. We have had their history, their mistakes, their rights, and their stories to learn from. I am not going to get mad at them for us failing to figure out what we have been stuck pathologically in. I am not going to get mad at any group of people that have mastered their conflicting obstacles in themselves to overcome them in themselves.

    To “know thyself” is not framework for warfare or enterprise. It’s virtue. Simple. Antiquity if so powerful should and would have left us more power. It’s not that the Bible(s) has power or does the prophet, Jesus. He was just a man. What is powerful is the will of the people to follow through with an action plan. And Afrocentricity in “knowing thyself” is not an action plan. It is a saying. Those who defend it has yet to make it mean anything other than a feel-good sentiment. What’s the framework and action plan, benchmarks, contingency, goal?

    I like the Bible because the stories and teachings are relevant to now. It’s cyclical. It’s repetitive. It’s a guide. And I don’t go to church, have always been suspicious of churches, and have always had an issue with church that got me spankings after services because it was all in my attitude and on my face. But because I deny modern Christianity imposed on my people in the Low Country, I still don’t attach to Afrocentricity as alternative refuge which is a pouting ideology of remaining obsessed to return to a place in the reverse when the reversing life is impossible and has never been done. It’s a maddening theory of behavior. It is regressive…not progressive.

    I agree with Rick’s examples. Melanie Douglass, Frederick Douglass’ great-great-granddaughter told me that Mr. Douglass did not like Christianity because it was religion. He did however study and regard the Bible. And it was Dr. King who used the Bible to shame poverty in this capitalistic country and to pose arguments against oppression. Exactly as Rick’s example, Mrs. Tubman was using the hypocrisy of colonizers to not come to terms with their similarities to Egyptian oppressors and others that enslaved. So much more she was trying to make a case of in doing her action plan by pissing on the ideology of Christianity, a man-made religion that adopted a new face and voice to fit whatever agenda of the dominant people practicing it.

    It’s been our burden as the legacies of captivity to have Christianity burden us with man-made conversion placed upon it to manifest in controlling us into a suppressive, regressive state.

    As much as THE CHOSEN fought against their enemies in warfare, the Bible(s) justified with reason why one should follow the covenant if they wanted to win. That can be translated to so many cultures to understand very real-life quandaries that are void of religion reflection. The Bible(s) are the greatest tool to enforce or contradict man-made laws and man-made excuses and reasoning. Antiquity has not left us this so I revere what is left in books.

    The fact is: through a criminal, torturous long-term act of claiming ownership of a people’s past, present, and future by capture, all was lost but something was given to help us along the way. It was not Christianity as it has evolved for colonialism as the gift but the Books were. History books were forbidden but the Bible(s), acceptable, was double-binded with history lessons more powerful than secular historic tales in books prohibited then that we should not have heard or learned from.

    Antiquity although removed and antiquity destroyed, antiquity should have still had more power if it was the antiquities with the power. I think it was the people, our people, that were of issue but we don’t want to consider that because it discounts and discredits our esteemed existence. We refuse to admit so much of what we believe and is termed Afrocentricity is manufactured by our own to make-up. Make-up does not help cover the holes. I can build without the camouflage. I rather build without the camouflage of dealing with what is fact: we are a people void of documented history and that does not make me feel less than human. I use it as my story. I own that story. It is the strongest, proud story because it is authentic and unquestionable. And from there, I can build a legacy for the future to identify that they came from a people that came to terms that they were conquered and destroyed to know (thyself) that they only had a future to build instead of lament a past lost.

    The fact is however and many Blacks hate this but we, we are not dominant and if we had the texts that were burned or stolen, it would still not reverse the choices our people have made for centuries to put us in this position. You can’t blame that on the better component even if that component, vicious and ruthless, almost completely annihilated your people. Warfare is not about being friendly or fair. This is life. It is Darwinian — the survival of the fittest — not the noblest. Survival by being superior was what motivated people’s determinations. Not ours. And it shows.

    And Egypt is not sub-subharan Africa — meaning we don’t know if we were of them and if they accepted our tribes down south, west, or in East Africa. There are so many unknown dynamics but books are firm. We don’t know if we were part of Egypt or if we were their despised enemy. Sorry!

    The Bible is tool of reference. Afrocentricity is mind-blogging that it is based on holding a concrete gripe on wanting the past back when life does not manifest that way.

    I think if anything we rationalize this as the Tom and Jerry effect…The Tom and Jerry Dynamics.

    Let me simplify in using a cartoon example: We are emulating still waiting for Tom to conquer Jerry not to realize Tom was stupid and should have ignored Jerry and marked his own path. Jerry marked a path that Tom, too weak to decide how to lead his life on his own independent of his obsession. Where we are as a people, we lament what was lost never to structure building forward other than trying to recreate and maintain a still place (not a moving forward place). We lament and thinking that if everyone just lamented the same and at the same time, it would mobilize magic to reverse our decline. I hated Tom and Jerry as a small child because it was redundant. Tom was not a strong contender against that mouse and he didn’t have the wisdom to confront his weakness to learn he was wasting time repeating his predicament to further cement his demise. Tom could have found his strength and recovered if he had just moved on and moved forward in mapping out a plan to do for Tom and stop sweating Jerry’s arrogance and disregard. Time probably would have been on his side to actually propel him further because he would know from those mistakes to not get caught up obsessing about the failures and embarrassment. He would have used that as drive. It is usually then when the underdog does surpass the grand champion because the champion would have remained at the same pace while the underdog would have been working twenty-times harder and forty-times faster. Ingenuity developed would have created a new legacy for Tom. He would have finally had direction instead of REACTING and waiting for his chance. He would have made chances on another path.

    The sad thing about cartoons is that they are built on models of psychological patterns and behaviors of humans. Sad.

    Life…the Circle of Life…The Food Chain…None of it…The Totem-pole…Life has no regard for empathy or sympathy to revere and safeguard a group of people — any people — not our people — because they/we were the oldest. Real life does not give a damn. Real life does not care that people stole and annihilated the first people. It’s irrelevant because the conquerors get the glory and are studied for their ingenuity in battle, war, and enterprise. That is what motivated prehistoric man so why do we disregard human behavior set in places millions of years ago. Real life regards that that group that CANNOT master war, in even defending themselves, and without the ability and hunger to capitalize on invention, they are considered as weak and unfit. Mankind has been conquering each other since prehistoric days probably over food or a woman to procreate with, these too reasons I suppose are what are two things needed for a living person’s continuum. Nothing has changed. And no one gets a pass because they WERE ONCE the wisest or holiest because if they were TRULY, they would still be. We have manifested a truth we don’t want to accept and we have chosen to pick and choose a redemptive claim to justify worth of our existence. I refused to over-compensate make-believe because it does nothing but creates false courage, false pride, false everything that has proven we have nothing to stand on in strength. We have to come clean to become stronger.

    We, Blacks, want to revise history to exalt our ancestors when our ancestors probably just was in the wrong place at the wrong time or they were just as human and treacherous but not as good contenders against people with a PLAN and that plan was dominating them. That is life. Survival of the fittest.

    Now we can talk and argue all day about how inhumane and haughty that was and is but I still see everyone still doing it all around the world. But I have witnessed that people who were once colonized or “done dirty” turning the axis. India and China didn’t remain stuck pouting and waiting to be exalted. They adapted. And eventhough they can’t be written in some noble way American Historians rewrite America as the great humanists, India and China is not sweating how they look. They want to recover and survive because they learned that it is not about being the noble victim, you have to compete in spite of how dirty you have been done and for how so long.

    Are our people supposed to be continually exalted as the virtuous victims because we didn’t have gunpowder and weapons ready? Because we were living somewhat peaceful lives as how Afrocentrics tell it, I wonder if that peacefulness was actually docile behavior or were we under the control of one of our own that controlled us that we never were prepared to considered outside captivity?

    I can separate feeling sorry for my ancestors because too much time has passed with opportunity to stop the course we are in up to now. I detest that Christianity was used to control us because I see the remnants and by-products of the destruction it has placed on our people but what has been given to us is books. The Bibles are books and they have stories of history and warfare that we could have used to learn from. The Bibles are not Christianity. Christianity is man-made contorted religion formed and pushed by followers and said-followers of Christ. And we how much value that renders. Scriptures are cheat-sheets that can help you along without a human pushing their agenda or ideology. So I will not deny the scriptures written by mortal men because they are relevant of ideas, virtue, faith, and history forewarned not to be repeated. The Bibles are a study guide on how to not replicate certain tribes and if anything, we can learn that the chosen people of the books fought for their liberation in armies. They did not wait for mysticism to honor them that they were the oldest and exalt them. They had to fight and lose lives because others were coming to wipe them out. Survival of the fittest.

    Revisionist history has plagued us wanting to be redeemed as the noble victims of colonialism when mankind has always conquered others. That is what this country is about and it is our duty to safeguard ourselves by understanding no one is going to make us the exempt victims of virtue to not be touched. The world does not work that way. It is our responsibility to adapt and move on to not allow the oppression to continue.

    We are not going back to some era where we could have been running our own kingdoms of antiquity. You can’t reverse time and choices already made. We can’t recover those things lost. We can only build future legacies.

    No matter how evil the world is and how evil our colonists were and are, it is our responsibility to stop being willing victims waiting for the world to apologize to us. (Reparations is another thing. I am talking about this eternal pouting instead of realizing that you don’t advance standing still waiting for someone to come apologize to you when the world turns and advancements continue to leave you unfit for long-term survival.) This Guyanese physicist once told me that there are so many civilizations that no longer exist and we, as a common people of African descent, refuse to understand that life has no favorites. It is about survival. It’s Darwinian and life does not give a fuck about antiquity.

    My friend, a Seneglese American, born and raised in DC told me that she is troubled by this too of what she sees her people are stuck in in wanting to maintain a place of being the regaled the virtuous victim. She sees it is the most frustrating thing to see all of her people in Senegal, Paris, St. Kitts, and in DC are stuck wanting history to reverse itself.

    There really is no place for this discussion and making this a platform Blacks will reciprocate is hard to introduce and build because we, Blacks, are taught to process life in understanding A + B = C when A + B now equals S. We are still stuck on rudimentary understandings of what happened or how we think it did but not in what power we gave to it developing in something so advanced it makes no sense anymore to us. Besides what is kept from us in the Vatican and in other secret societies around the world, we have been given one tool our opposition used that we could also use as our tool to counter-act. That path to figuring out the steps of the formula however has always been with us and it screams to be figured out and not continually denied for its older simplicity.

    There is a reason the Bible(s) exist. I am sorry that antiquity does not prevail. I understand how to take what we have and work with it. I choose not to manipulate what is real and relevant to justify a prettier esteem for us to swallow when the truth is never easy to swallow.

    I agree with so much Rick last said. I don’t go to church. Don’t trust it but I would go if our people were trying to be noble and not heretics. So all I have is history to hold onto. History written and history deduced. I can’t invest on lies told to me to control me by all factions of my own besides those outside of the race. Prophecy is a gift no matter what group it was intended for. We can always learn from others mistakes, especially when ours is worse.

    Like Tom and Jerry…Jerry could have been an afterthought and Tom, the King Cat if he stopped to realize his only goal rendered value in chasing in a circle — when he thought it was one-up’n his nemesis, a mouse. Jerry was not his enemy…his stupidity of himself was.

    Each generation must, out of relative obscurity, discover its mission, fulfill it, or betray it.

    Franz Fanon

    Tom, the cat, did not discover his mission and nor do we. We betray it holding onto man-made cushions instead of accepting the straight truths.

  21. Rick

    Blacksurvial, I am of the view that black people can have an intelligent exchange of views without someone taking offense — especially if they are both about uplifting the race (like we are). I responded to you in that spirit. I do believe when making an argument, one should it, so that people can read the facts then make up their own minds. We are all here to learn. If I am missing something, school us.

    Genesis 12 is CLEAR about how Abram (even before he was “Abraham”) was called with a promise that God would later fullfill for his people. He accepted that call, under his own free will. And, this “father of faith” was a vessal helping to spark 3 world religions: the origins of Judeism, Christianity, and Islam.

    But my response was to rebutt the notion that Christianity was something that was “imposed” as it relates to black civilization. My argument is that there was a more fluid interaction between Blacks and Christianity — one in which we, from antiquity to Harriet Tubman, were active (not docile).

  22. Rick

    well, Blacksurvial, I wrote back before I could read your second message at 10:44, which was unfortunate. I’m done with this.

    (Andrea, you are like one of those proud Nubian sistas talked about in message 1/21 @ 2:09 am :-)

  23. Chesapeake

    In my humble opinion, one cannot examine the validity of Christianity by a few examples of men and women who occupy(ied) some of the pulpits and minsitries. Nor can one claim that the few examples of men and women who occupy some of the pulpits and ministries represent flaws in Christianity because they support Clinton.

    First, I estimate that there are exponentially more strong, fearless, loving, devoted, selfless, humble, generous, moral, ethical, trustworthy, honest, law-abiding, serving, giving, self-effacing, self-sacrificing, reverant, patient, kind, gentle, self-controlled, dependable, compassionate, passionate, forgiving, martyred, and apologetic (notice the avoidance of “holy”, “righteous”, “godly”, “god-fearing”, “Christ-like”, “Holy Spirit-filled”,etc., to avoid the arguments and emotions these words evoke) people in and out of the pulpit and ministries than you can name as vagrants. All humanity is flawed, Christians live wrapped in flesh susceptible to the sins of this world, tempered by the extent of devotion to the new command and the maturity and constant renewing and re-generation of our minds. Unfortunately, Christians sin and fall – some further than others. Nevertheless, measuring Christianity by any man is an uncalibrated measurement.

    Second, what difference does it make who “Rev. Joe” supports when judging his status as prophet and teacher? Truly, it is, or must be, the “citizen” in “Rev. Joe” who makes that choice. Like many of you whose comments I’ve read on this blog, I believe that “Rev. Joe’s” choice of Clinton is a horrible choice. But that’s my opinion. I also believe that Obama is a bad choice.

    All of the candidates are lacking, but I’m committed to my man. My choice says something about me as a “citizen” and Christian. But what says more about me as a Christian is my rationale. All that my choice says about me is that I checked my beliefs and passions and matched them to a candidate who is running against yours.

    Sure, I can say that “if Clinton or Obama becomes president, she or he will be beholden to the big corporations and status quo that gave big to and advised her or him, and therefore they are lying about what they are going to do in office;” but, really, I could be wrong and one of them may actually execute a plan to aid the orphans and widows and finally start leveling the field in America and the world. The clergy and civil rights leaders I criticize for backing Clinton may be right – perhaps they have worked it so they are the influencers rather than the influencees. So, one can’t really determine these people’s commitment to Christ’s teaching by their support.

    Finally, with respect to all beliefs and in the spirit of love, I offer the following for enlightenment:

    1. The Law did not exist before God gave it to Moses to give to Israel. It is true that civiliztions developed between Adam and Eve and Abraham (Abram), and even further still between Abraham and Moses. Law codes did exist (and some have survived) to set the moral and ethical standards of the civilizations (examples being the Laws of Eshnunna and the Law Code of Hammurabi). But the Law did not exist until God authored it!

    2. Jesus said “I am the way, the truth, and the life. No man comes to the father but by me.” This is a bold statement coming from “a man.” The way some of us see it, either Jesus was lying, a lunatic, or he was telling the truth. If He was doing anything short of telling the truth, He could not have been a prophet (at least not a prophet of The Almighty)!! Also, contrary to contemporary beliefs that espouse the existence of many truths, there is only one truth! Was Jesus telling the truth, was He lying, or is He a lunatic?

    The “citizen” in me says “may the democratic process do the best it can to elect the best leader it can.”

    Grace and shalom!

  24. Anon 1

    Barack Obama should be ashamed that all his powerful speeches are written by a young white man. Rev. Martin Luther King Jr. was writing his own speeches when he could barely talk. This is why I cannot grasp the authenticity of Obama. It is an insult to us to hear Obama plagiarize King speaking style and past it off as his own. And King would never use a telepromter to speak to the nation. Obama needs to speak from his heart and start writing his own works if he wants full credit for his speeches that will go down in history.

    Us black folks are great orators and writers. Maybe he should hire Skeptical Brotha

  25. Cliff

    In defense of Black Survival.

    You were doing good untiiiiiiiiil, you made some statements, some statements, I can’t let go.

    Since you all went there, we’ll have you delve deeply.

    Plunge…

    Plunge…

    “You can’t blame that on the better component even if that component, vicious and ruthless, almost completely annihilated your people.”

    Hmmm, “better component”…
    More like a Satanic component. Satan is styled as Pharaoh in the Bible. Yes Pharaoh, Satan.

    “I know that Jews mastered something we have not been able to. We have had their history, their mistakes, their rights, and their stories to learn from. I am not going to get mad at them for us failing to figure out what we have been stuck pathologically in. I am not going to get mad at any group of people that have mastered their conflicting obstacles in themselves to overcome them in themselves.”

    Plunge…

    Okay, I can see that. I mean I saw that. The mastery of the original man has been given a time period. It is styled in the scriptures of the Bible about the Original Black people of North America being the fulfillment of the scriptures as prophesized of the Children of Israel (Acts 33:1) as being saved by the Lord through Moses for which they suffered under the affliction of those of whom have mastered them, i.e. Pharaoh.

    God steps in to reclaim His people, and sets aflame to world of the former masters, or slave-masters.

    “And Egypt is not sub-subharan Africa – meaning we don’t know if we were of them and if they accepted our tribes down south, west, or in East Africa. There are so many unknown dynamics but books are firm. We don’t know if we were part of Egypt or if we were their despised enemy. Sorry!”

    Sorry it was black people ruling in Egypt who simulated the features of those of our people of sub-subharan Africa.

    Sorry, someone lied to you.

    Sorry, they can not hide the truth anymore.

    Sorry, they no longer master us.

    The enemy is Sorry, Pharaoh is Sorry, Satan is Sorry, that God forced him to allow us access to the Internet.

    http://users.cyberone.com.au/myers/diop.html

    http://wysinger.homestead.com/finally.html

    Egypt, yep black people too. Yep our people too. Yep, historically proven too. Everywhere huh.

    “To “know thyself” is not framework for warfare or enterprise. It’s virtue. Simple.”

    Too late, been there done that.

    With Love :)

  26. blacksurvival

    I’ve been out of town and unable to respond.I sincerely did not mean to offend anyone of the Christian faith.I study the not only Bible,and the one sided history given us Europian shcolars,I also enjoy the unherald research most resently made available to us through Black historians such as John Henrick Clark,Dr.Diops,Carter G.Woodson,James George,Indus Kush,Dr.Yosef A.A.ben-Jochannan,Anwar Kewasi,Dr.Fances Cress Welsing,Macus Garvey, W.E. DuBois to name a view.These great black minds FOR ME!seem to even out the perspective totality of the Europian view of history.
    One fact though even white historians agree upon at the half way point of civilized history about 3500 years ago there was no Sahara Desert it incroached on the northern grassland of Africa in about a hundred years.That the ancient Kemetic or Egytian were actually were a melting pot of different African or Akabulan cultures traveling north from the Blue & White Nile to the Nile to the so called Med Sea.
    My disagreement with the Bible history is that the Egyptian people(and we must understand that Egypt is a Europian word.So I only use it so that we are on the same page.)were maticulous historians as evidenced by the stone writing still in exsistence.Also since Moses according to the Bible could have written the history of the Hebrews only after having the benifit of the only educational system of the time.Being precieved as the Pharoh’s grandson he probably was very well educated and having use of the worlds first written language.This is the point where the story get somewhat skewed.Ramses II living such a long well documented life,there is no mention of Moses or the mass diaspora of any people.Nor in any other Dynasty.
    I won’t argue the race of the Kemetic or Egyptian people,but Kemetic is tranlated to mean Black Land and Chemistry is the study of black matter.Many White historian would enterpret it to mean the black sands of the Nile.I would say do a search of Ancient Egyptian Statuary and Hyroglyphics I would say and some agree they looks Nubian to me.King Tut’s statue is as black as cole.

    Also I and many other scholar my also be wrong in interpreting the Greeks the root of the Europian school of thought to have claim the phylosophies and sciences of these peoples as there own.Phylosopies and sciences that exsisted mellennias before the Greeks themselves exsisted.

    Lastly it seem that every Patriarch of the Bible from Abraham to Jesus went to Egypt.You think that Jesus spending the first 12 years of his life in Egypt in the midst of this Ancient Knowledge (maybe black knowledge) that still exsists, maybe had anything to do with the forming of his foreign phylosophies.Which seem awfully simalar to the Egyptian Judge of the dead belief system.Foreign to the Pharsees , Sudduses and Judaism.Which is why he was, some scriptures say hung from a tree.By the Europian power structure.

    My point of Christianity being imposed upon the subconcious of every person of color is the mental picture of a White blue eyed Jesus commissioned to Leonardo di Vinci to paint almost a thousand years after Jesus was supposed to have lived.Who told di Vinci after a Europian dark age that Jesus was a Europian.This mental image of Christ(the only image) has done irreparable damage to the human computor of every person of color,in negating ourselve.So I am sorry that I feel the people that perpatrate this on our people are guilty of mental genocide.Question ?Does anyone know why the KKK burns a cross at hanging and decapatation of Black Men only and Black Men.

    Love And Peace

  27. blacksurvival

    Andrea

    I’m sorry you feel that way.Many Black historians, great mind have spent there entire lives to prove that there is Great Black History as there are low points in Black History that emcompass the span of civilized man.Because I choose to study there there thoughts I and all who do are offended not agered that you would like White scholars sums it up as Afrocentricity.Is the study of Europian Greatness that that is the basis western education sum up as Eurocentricity egnoring or better yet romantisizing the very low points of Europian History.1000 years ago most of Euorope did not have a window, yes I said a window.While there were Black Universities in Timbuktu and Spain.

    It is a shame that most Black People sum up our exsistence as the anscestor of slaves.It make the many Great Black Mind and White Minds that spent there life in uncovering History never meant to be known by Black people a total waste. Andea check outs some books by John Henrick Clark an easy read but very enlightning.I try to read everything on history Black and White.We have made very Great contributions
    to the exsistence of man.I’m sorry Baby Egypt is Africa.

  28. blacksurvival

    Also I made a miscalulation by the time of Solomon more than half of the exsistence homosapian-sapian Modern man had past not according to the Bible,but physical evidence.I don’t think the ancient Egyptians would consider themselve oppressers.Every story has two sides.

  29. Cliff

    My bad, I was referring to Exodus 33:1 not Acts. Unto the land that was sworn to Abraham.

    Genesis 15:13

    Black People of North America, being strangers in a land that is not theirs. Serving Who? Afflicted by Who? for how long? 400 Years. Is that us? Naww can’t be. :)

  30. Rick

    Cliff,
    I refuse to view myself as “afflicted”. I claim this land as my land. It’s just as much ours given the centuries of blood, sweat and tears our ancestors placed into it. Yes, I took what Nas said literally: “the world is mine.” Claim it, my brother.

    Blacksurvival,
    If you knew the history of african-americans during during the antebellum period — and your writings (not my assumptions) suggest you don’t — you wouldn’t make such silly and inaccurate statements about a perceived inability of black folks to resist dominant culture more generally. You would not have said:

    “This mental image of Christ(the only image) has done irreparable damage to the human computor of every person of color,in negating ourselve”

    If you studied our history, then you’d also know many of our ancestors packed antivirus software to protect from internationalizing viruses — like the idea white supremacy — from being passed from computer to computer, or from one generation to the next.

    this infatuation with a white man, who died centuries ago by the way, reminds me of Andrea’s example about how Tom wasted his whole life trying to catch Jerry, when he could have been ‘King Cat’ by focusing on improving himself and things that really mattered.

    That’s what my parents taught me:
    I was taught that I was made in the image and likeness of God. That I am a child of God. I believed them. (My christian church doesn’t even have any portraits in the first place to say otherwise!)

    I was taught that I am the Head and not the Tail.

    And, as a child God, I have a claim to God’s kingdom (not just after I die and go to heaven either).

    If you were serious about “knowing yourself”, you wouldn’t have made so many negative/condescending remarks about black people more generally (e.g. ebonics – JE-SUS)…because you would know otherwise.

    You’d also know that you are not the only one up in here who has read any books, and that many of the people who frequent this forum are masters and mistresses of knowledge in their respective fields, just as it was the case with our ancestors both here and in Africa.

  31. blacksurvival

    Rick
    What in Black utopia do you reside.In most of our Americsn cities as in Africa at present we are experiencing a mass self-hate self genocide of young Black men I guess to you is of no consequence.Despite
    statically there being more committed in the White community Black male experience more than triple the rate of incarceration.Am I also imagining the mass genocide in Africa.Where do you live that black people are doing so great evidently not in a major American city.How do you explain the mysogonistic treatment of our women. I’m sorry I offended you with the all to grim picture for black males worldwide.If there is another side to this genocide clue me in.
    Please explain to me why it is so easy for us to sell poison to eachother,and take eachothers life as a point of our culture.Does this even mattter?
    Rick I’m a business man born hustler from Chi I do very well for myself ,Beautiful wife 3 homes,3 cars and 2 sons in college.I could very easily sport the bling and egnore all the pain that is going on around me.I can’t. If you obtain all that you desire.Do the other have nots matter?

  32. Rick

    BlackSurvival,
    Can we stick to ONE topic at a time? The topic is “Blacks and Christianity.” And your position is that Christianity has hurt rather than helped the black community. We all have the right to our own opinions. BUT, you took it further than that…

    You also spoke ill about black Christians speaking EBONICS, in JE-SUS name, and all christians of color being brainwashed because some white man centuries again painted some portrait. If nonsense wears the coat of intellectualism, shall that pass? I think not.

    We are all aware of the grim statistics, Blacksurvial. And as a black male, I too neither want financially, nor has my street cred/ghetto pass been revoked. But to answer your question: Why do some black people hate themselves, and hate our women, and committ unthinkable/unspeakable acts.

    I think we’d both agree as a starting point that it’s because they don’t know who they are and such individuals do not have knowledge of self.

    But where we disagree is my belief that it’s also because we as a people have turned AWAY from God — not because we turned TO God, which seems to be your perspective.

    Some of us up in here — NOT CAPTURED IN THOSE STATISTICS — made it through only because those before us kept the faith, or like an Abraham, turned away from the world to a life that God is pleased with. Their sacrifices, faith and beliefs should not be made a mockery.

  33. blacksurvival

    Not a mockery I just think this is a point of control for the Racism/White Supremacy System.Religion has always been the handmaiden of conquerers.

  34. Rick

    Well just as our history pre-dates slavery to a time when we were kings and queens, I don’t view us a conquered people either. My parents raised me to be more than a conquerer.

    You asked where I got these “utopian” ideas from. My HOME. My CHURCH. My SCHOOL (private). My after-school COMMUNITY activities (karate class) — which each reinforced upon the other the values of discipline, the importance of education and knowledge of self.

    The true essence of “black survival” in North America is that whether you grew up on a plantation during the antebellum period, or on the mean streets of the inner city during the Reagen era like I did — if you had family, community support, valued learning, kept the faith — you damn sure had a fighting chance! You also were very well equipped to RESIST the dominant culture and not to internalize black self hatred.

    The problem, as I see it, is that so many of our young black men do not come from loving families, they attend underperforming schools, they do not have good afterschool programs, and they do not know any God.

    In the abscence of these things, it is only logical what I see as them turning to gangs for any semblance of “community” — especially since we as professional black men are M.I.A. and most of us have effectively ridden them off as another “lost” generation. All the problems that you cited above. I don’t blame some white man. You can’t blame the church for this.

    Collectively, it’s OUR fault. Because we as Black Men have failed to check it to this point and to set our houses in order. We have forgotten who we are, and in some cases still don’t know and don’t want to know. How can you be a child of God and be conquered?

    When will we as black men, collectively, stop viewing ourselves as “afflicted” or “conquered” and rise up — like our sisters are currently doing — and set our houses in order. I’m not talking about intellectualizing about it. When will we stop blaming dead white men who have been dead for centuries and take action to become the MEN, the Kings, the King Cats our women and children are looking for us to be?

    When we do take action, then and only then, we will take our rightful place in this society with our Queens who are already getting theirs. This ain’t utopia brother, just as sure as it ain’t no “fairy tale” either. This is as real as I am typing this post.

  35. Marla K.

    Rick wrote:

    The problem, as I see it, is that so many of our young black men do not come from loving families, they attend underperforming schools, they do not have good afterschool programs, and they do not know any God.

    In the abscence of these things, it is only logical what I see as them turning to gangs for any semblance of “community” — especially since we as professional black men are M.I.A. and most of us have effectively ridden them off as another “lost” generation

    I have just become aware of these posts and would like to make a couple of points I feel are important

    Rick, I am a person who loves those you refer to as a lost generation, and I greatly appreciate your insight into the circumstances of these youth, OUR YOUTH. Although the nation turned it’s back on them, and betrayed them, they are not irrecoverable. Most of the youth that are incarcerated only need homes…this means “professional group care” with love and attention from black men mentors who can provide structure and guidance.

    I cannot say that individual black men are at fault because all of us are caught up in this “system” which has been and is oppressive. We need some critical policy changes. Somehow we must gather our self esteem, recognize that we deserve so much more and demand a fair “justice” system.

    Hillary N the Hood highlights the plight of African American men being continually exploited.
    Black men make up close to 90% of the prison population in the US, and as SB’s information reveals: the rate of incarceration of black men increased almost a 150% (138.4%) during the Reagan Administration. The rate decreased to about 100% (100.4%) above the previous rate during the Clinton Administration. The severe increase came about in the Reagan Administration and somwhat decreased during the Clinton administration….but certainly nothing to brag about.

    This is abominable discrimination on race, and must be stopped.

    As far as the presidential election, we as African Americans, and all others who care about justice and equality as we say we do in America, have a unique opportunity to vote for someone who certainly seems to be committed to a better America. This person happens to be a brotha…..Please take my word for it…Barack Obama is not our Lord and Savior, but he is very close to our Lord in his Heart….and he is a brillant man.

    “If you are a person, you should vote for Barack Obama, because Barack Obama is a peoples’ president”.

    However, in the off chance that Barack Obama does not win the primary election we will face the challenge of voting for Hillary or relinguishing our lives to the Republican party once again….

    From my own writings:

    There is always danger in apathy, giving up on participating in electing our governing officials. Clearly there is power in our votes or there would not continue to be such creative efforts to prevent us from voting. It is discouraging to have only two choices of political parties, when one is poorly addressing our issues and the other is creating our issues. However, the choice remains clear; we must continue to vote for the one that is poorly addressing our issues until we can do better.

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